Leaders of the Proposition 8 ban on gay marriage are holding a press conference at noon in Santa Ana today to complain of “the outrageous campaign of blacklisting, harassment, and intimidation against supporters of the Yes on 8 Campaign.” I’ll be reporting on their specific complaints, and getting response from the opponents of Prop. 8.
Leaders of the opposition movement have generally endorsed peaceful endorsements and, to so extent, boycotts of businesses backing the measure, but have condemned violence, threats and vandalism. There are at least two more O.C. anti-Prop. 8 protests scheduled for this weekend (10:30 a.m., Saturday, at Irvine City Hall, and 10 a.m. Sunday at the Mormon Temple in Newport Beach).
If you don’t already see it below, you can click on the following prompt to see the “Yes on Prop. 8″ press release on today’s press conference.
MEDIA ADVISORY
ProtectMarriage.com/Yes on Proposition 8 Campaign Leadership Responds To Outrageous Campaign of Blacklisting, Harassment and Intimidation Against Supporters of Marriage
FRIDAY, NOVEMBER 14— Noon
SANTA ANA DOUBLETREE HOTEL BALLROOM
WHAT: The leadership and coalition partners for the ProtectMarriage.com/Yes on Proposition 8 campaign will address the outrageous campaign of blacklisting, harassment, and intimidation against supporters of the Yes on 8 Campaign. Churches have been defaced. Employers of donors and volunteers for Yes on 8 have been intimidated into firings, and forced resignation of employees who simply exercised their constitutional right to participate in the political process. African-Americans have been accused of abandoning civil rights. Florida and Arizona also passed identical constitutional amendments by large margins on November 4th, making a total of 30 U.S. states that have felt strongly enough about traditional marriage to place it in their constitutions. Only in California have protests and targeting of faiths and voters been encouraged. A total of 44 out of 50 states currently have laws upholding traditional marriage. Californians passed Proposition 8 by a five point margin, carrying the votes of the majority of counties in California.
WHO: Yes on 8 Chairman Ron Prentice, Yes on 8 Co-Campaign Manager Frank Schubert, and Coalition Members and Speakers including representatives of the Catholic Church, Evnagelical Protestants, African-America and Latino Pastors, and victims of harassment and intimidation.
WHEN: Friday, November 14th, 12 p.m.
WHERE: Santa Ana Doubletree Hotel, 201 East MacArthur Boulevard
CREDENTIALED MEDIA ONLY
When individuals, businesses or groups have actively worked to take away fundamental civil rights from a minority group, they should not be surprised the group affected will use legal means to retaliate. For those who say “the people have spoken, accept it”, please understand we will not simply give up. The right to marry is fundamental - and a right that was taken away by a slim majority from the minority. There is a reason we have judicial review - to protect against this sort of tyranny. This will be overturned, just like inter-racial marriage bans were overturned in the last century.
Ha! let them boycott and intimidate all they want. Its hilarious. Why should we care? Imagine how much easier it will be to support marriage when this comes up on the ballot again? Just keep showing commercials of all the rioting and hate. done.
It’s pretty dangerous what’s been going on. The anti-Prop 8 crowd is actually targeting even small $100 donors who supported the measure by protesting at their private shops and asking patrons to put them out of business! This intimidation damages the political process! People will be less likely to offer public donations to their cause of choice since they might put their financial well-being at risk by doing so! This is certainly not the american way! Stop acting like little children and work within the system!
The right to marry is a fundamental right between a man and a woman. NOT between a man and a man, or a woman and a woman. Read your Constitutional law. Beyond that, homosexuals are NOT members of a protected class under the Constitution, so quit already with your baseless equal protection arguments - they’re wrong. Period.
Where’s the list of prop8 supporting shops?
I want to drive my SUV over to them and load it up with products!!!!
And they say they won’t take this to the schools. this is a very selfish movement. they will destroy anyone who has a different opinion than their own. they want tolerance yet they show no tolerance themselves.
I will support all business that support prop 8 and none that are no on 8. 52 to 48 percent(I wonder which business will hurt first). Gosh these people are annoining-don’t they see the big back lash coming-we don’t want gay marriage-IT is wrong!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
…and if it is overturned, it might be legal in your state, but it still does not make right or acceptable!
You said it yourself your the minority, a small group… the majority of the country understands the common sense of what really is marriage.
It some seem to me all also no tolerance for any view but their own-move out of my way-me-me-not caring how this will affect kids–every kid requires a mother and father
haha i love it. These cynical bigots actually thought they could vote away peoples civil rights and get away with it. They have done nothing more than energize homosexuals and those who support their cause . We will now be even more vocal than ever. Once again, religious fundamentalism and ignorance will fail
Yup, what do these people expect? When you embrace the same principles that our enemies do (remember, homosexuality is illegal in Iran, Iraq, Saudi Arabia, and most terrorist countries), you set yourself up for this kind of backlash!!!
You can’t hate our enemies, and embrace their principles at the same time!
Remember, Bin Laden, and Al-Qaeda LOVE the FACT that Prop 8 passed!!!!
If you support Prop 8, you support the same principles of those who attacked us on 9/11!!!
To JR
Would it be possible to um, get a clue?
A democracy protects the rights of all people. Not just the ones you want to. As far as being “legal but not right” the judges already weighed in on this.
If they say prop 8 is discriminating, they better allow polygamy and incest. They are adults as well.
“When individuals, businesses or groups have actively worked to take away fundamental civil rights from a minority group”
Take away rights? Minority group? Retaliate? Retaliate?
The issue is homosexuality. Not rights, not minority as in race. The issue is that some people believe homosexuality is wrong and bad for families and society. Just as other laws, they are their because people believe it is best for society. We vote for what we believe in, like it or nor. Abortion is legal, yet many do not believe it should be but they have to accept it.
People voted, this is the outcome. Anyone who doesn’t like it can vote again.
1) Marriage is not a civil right, it is a privilige granted to a man and a woman that wants to create a family to build up society
2) The right gays had to marry was granted by a 4-3 court decision against the will of the majority of the people. And it was only around for a few months. You say it’s a “fundamental” right like it’s inalienable or been around for you since the dawn of time, puleaze…
interesting that bad is good now and good is bad, incredible
Use legal means to peacefully protest, of course. But mailing suspicious powders, “outing” donors (how ironic is that?) and other tactics are starting to resemble those used by anti-abortion groups (bombing clinics, killing doctors, etc.) I’m not saying we’re there yet, but man, it sure looks like it’s heading in that direction.
I was against Prop 8 but I can’t get behind some of the tactics now being used by anti-8 folks.
People fighting for sexual deviancy and immorality acting as if people with morals and values are the bad guys. We seriously are living in the last days.
Lol! This is right out of the Religious Right playbook!
In July the conservative American Family Association launched a boycott against McDonald’s in response to the fast-food chain’s support of the National Gay and Lesbian Chamber of Commerce. Just for that!!! Wow!
Remember the Disney boycott? The Ford Boycott? The Target Boycott? Christians will boycott anything at the slightest blink of a gay eye. Google “Christian Boycott.”
At least there hasn’t been any shootings. Remember all the abortion doctors that were shot. Eric Robert Rudolf blew up an abortion clinic and a gay bar. Then there are those ugly anti abortion protest posters. Disgusting,
Any of you pro-lifers change your core beliefs on abortion because of Rudolf’s tactics? I didn’t think so
“If you support Prop 8, you support the same principles of those who attacked us on 9/11!!!”
This is the kind of manipulation that discounts No on 8 people. Please grow up.
The issue is homosexuality. It is a sexual practice. Who is condemning homosexuals by not allowing them to have a marriage license? No one is judging YOU, except yourself. People believe what they believe, you can’t change it. But to judge others as this absurd statement is unfair. Do you want to be judged the same way?
These are not fundamental “civil-rights” of a minority group. They are the request’s of a lifestyle group. Yell at me all you wan’t, but I am voicing what many concervatives like me believe. And if you see me on the street don’t tear my cross away from me and push me, as you did that poor 60+ woman in the Springs, as all 6′1″ 230 of me might just push back. What has not been seen as of yet is that the majority of people are not intimidated in the fashion that you hope we are. How many times do we need to vote on this issues, it’s getting lame.
The rights of the kids are being ignored—could you imaging a girl starting her menstrating-she has to ack her two dads about this, this is almost ridiculous to think about, but these are real issues-kids do need a dad and mom
Why is nobody protesting President Obama? He is against same-sex marriage. You can just single out Mormons.
I voted NO on 8, however, this inappropriate and cowardly behavior by the NO voters of 8 has really turned me off. I am not the only person who may not vote the same next time around. The only recourse for NO voters will end up being the judicial system and that does not promote true cultural change just resentment. Don’t bite off your nose to spite your face….
tired of the attacks from the left directed at those who did not support their position on Prop 8. sorry, just as Obama passed so did Prop 8. now we have to deal with the consequences. and if the gay uh, community is going around targeting people, all I can say is the gays can stick it in their…… a’s
McG Says:
November 14th, 2008 at 11:46 am
“If they say prop 8 is discriminating, they better allow polygamy and incest. They are adults as well.”
How is “incest” between two consenting adults? Last I checked, incest involves CHILDREN!
Oh, and BTW… In Mexico, the Catholics already SUPPORT ‘incest’, as many young girls under the age of 18, are FORCED to get married and raped ALL the time!!! Also know, the same people who support this, are the same ones here that supported Prop 8!
people be nice
NoDivorce:
Any comment on the actual physical assaults or white powder mailed to Mormon headquarters?
Michael,
Please get your facts straight. Registering your wedded relationship with the state is optional. You can live the *SAME* life without registering with the state. Doesn’t matter if you are gay or straight. Prop 8 doesn’t physically force anyone to do anything, nor does it make anything illegal. It merely defines a legal term.
Suddenly everyone wants to pay for a license they don’t need. It’s as if everyone is clamoring for a state license to breathe air.
I like what McG says. Next we will have to vote to allow polygamy and incest. It is that minorities right to want to get married, right or wrong!!!
do you realinze most people on these blogs probably don’t have a job, they are probably bored stirring up trouble, don’t spend to much time here
It boggles my mind to understand why anyone would think this a critical issue.
Marriage is not a right. The shallowness of thinking on the left is amazing. We’ve just defined marriage (again!) and surprise, it’s the same as it has been in every society throughout all of history. It’s still defined the way it has been for 5,000 years by Judaism, Islam Buddhism and Christianity and all secular thinkers and philosophers that ever lived. The thug tactics of the left are disgusting. ” If we don’t get our way we will smash your income and your way of life”. These people are spoiled little children. The narcissisism and cowardice of these people is staggering.
Boy, I guess the shoe is on the other foot now. It was just one week prior to the election that many business owners who contributed to the No on 8 campaign received letters from the Yes on 8 campaign threatening to “out” their businesses if they did not send a matching contribution to the Yes on 8 campaign. I will be happy to exercise my right to avoid these companies now that it’s happening to them, so sorry if you feel you are being discriminated against. Doesn’t feel good, does it?
“no on h8″ have become terrorists.
a dangerous group.
hey gay people, how long before you came out of the closet. I have a gay friend who took almost 10 years to come out. If there is nothing wrong with it and should be accepted as part of “normal” culture, then why are all the gay people afraid to admit they are gay at the beginning? The reason is because it is not normal, it is not accepted. Maybe years down the road it will be, but for now its not. So stop trying to act like it is normal.
The problem I have with the No on people is the idea that churches are “hateful” and that they are the “same as those who attacked on on 9/11″.
With that kind of approach it is very unlikely to change anyones mind. If people are to be accepting of people that practice homosexuality then shouldn’t they conduct themselves in a less bitter and blaming way? How is that all of the sudden someone is going to say “Oh yeah, you’re right. Thanks for pointing out that I hate you and that I am the same as a terrorist”
bobbyc:
Adult brothers and sisters cannot marry because of incest laws too.
Right on! When you vote to take rights away from people do you expect them to give you a hug?
It seems the entire fight is over the word “marriage”, not about rights. Neither side is willing to give up the word. If it were about rights, the word would be abolished from civil law as it has religious implications that have no place in a legal contract that is a civil union. For people of faith, their marriage begins with a religious ceremony. The civil end of it is only required by law to facilitate legalities. Even when the civil union is ended, for people of faith, the union continues through life because it is God who united you, not the law. With this perspective, eliminating marriage/religion from the equation, all would be equal. If legislatures were coherent, this is the solution they would seek. As long as the fight is for “marriage”, there is no separation of church and state and therefore no equality because religion will continue to look at homosexuals as sinners unable to marry. So, what is this fight about? Rights or “Marriage”?
African-Americans voted YES to Prop 8 because your attached comparison to their struggle for equal rights is a JOKE. They can’t wake up one day and decide not to be Black.
Gays lost this battle because:
1. They didn’t care enough to march about their so called civil liberties being in jeopardy before Nov. 4th.
2. Most gays were clueless as a minority group to how Blacks viewed marriage and how many of them were offended that your so called “suffering” was liken to what they went through as a group.
3. You clearly underestimated the majority of Californians who hold marriage between a man and woman as sacrosanct.
Mick
Its not up to you or anyone else to decided who i can or cant marry. The majory of people in the past voted against interracial marriages, If it hadnt been for the supreme court it would still be right now. To keep traditional marriage you would need to out law interracial marriages again. I dont care if anyone thinks its wrong, in moral, or sick. Its not for you, then its not for you. Stop budding in, in other peoples life. Stop pushing your religion on others.
P.S. to NoDivorce (and now Chris): under the law, there is justification for “defense of others” up to and including the use of deadly force to prevent a murder. There is no similar justification for physical and terrorist attacks.
I hear the unibomber is being recruited by the no on 8 crowd
Michael Says:
For those who say “the people have spoken, accept it”, please understand we will not simply give up.
Remember the “like it or not speech” from San Francisco when the original ban was “overturned? Well the shoes on the other foot, princess!
See link for hypocrisy:
http://www.goodasyou.org/good_as_you/2008/11/just-so-all-you.html
I support ed yes on 8-I guess I may being getting the white powder in my mailbox soon
They couldn’t fool the public into voting for it, so now they’re trying to intimidate the public into allowing it. This is blackmail and coercion.
If it’s such a fundamental right, why have 44 out of 50 states defined marriage as heterosexual?
Get over it. You’re different, that’s all there is to it.
All I can say is: beware of the public backlash.
It’s coming, count on it.
No divorce, you use the same tactic of labeling people who don’t agree with you. Honestly, bringing up people who shoot abortion doctors. Should homosexual statistics be brought up as a weapon? We can’t judge all people that way. Each person has a different set of circumstances.
The issue is weather or not homosexual people should be allowed to have marriage licenses and thus change the convential family and many other things in society. Is it really so strange to question “two dads” or “two moms” or to question whether or not it is good to not grow up without one parent (your real dad or mom)? I think it’s fundamental to the family for obvious reasons, isn’t it?
Besides banning rights for homosexuals, when can we reinstate the following…
Lev.1:9 Burning a bulls on the altar as a sacrifice.
Exodus 21:7 Selling your daughters into slavery.
Lev.15:19-24 Forcing women to stay away from men during their monthly cycles.
Lev. 25:44 Taking slaves from foreigh countries. (oh wait, I forgot, we already do that with illigal immigrants).
Exodus 35:2 Putting to death anyone working on the Sabbath.
Lev. 11:10 Banning anyone from consuming shellfish.
Lev. 19:27 Banning men cutting their hair or beards.
Lev. 11:6-8 Touching ham products.
Lev. 19:19 Planting two different crops in the same field, or wearing clothing with mixed fabrics.
Lev.24:10-16 Putting to death anyone who cusses.
no tolerance- white powder is sent to anyone who doesn’t agree– talk about tolerance, trying to force this on us-it is wrong, morally wrong
Absolutely Jake! My comments are an envelope of flour arriving in the mail cannot possibly compare to the nurse in Birmingham who suffered through the blast of a hundred nails puncturing her face from a bomb blast that caused her to lose the sight in one eye from someone protesting abortion rights..
An envelope of flour pales in comparison of the police officer killed in the same attack. Or the bomb set off in the gay bar. Or the vivid blown up photos of aborted fetus’s planted on giant posters. It pales to the drs that lost their lives from assassination.
How about you Jake? Are you willing to embrace abortion rights because Rudolf blew up that abortion clinic?
I expect the Christian Right to any day now start counter-protesting, with giant protest signs covered with blown-up shots of gay men having sex. That would be right up their alley.
The OC Register really needs to start doing its homework. “There are at least two more O.C. anti-Prop. 8 protests scheduled for this weekend” — there are many more than 2! Any simple Googling can find that out!
There was a very large protest/march in Irvine last night that received no coverage from the OC Register. Your newspaper’s conservative leanings are well documented in this case.
The longer the NO on 8 group keeps this up, the less support they will maintain. Go register your domestic partnership and live your lives. Marriage is defined the same in every culture worldwide. You demand tolerance - well, it’s time for you to be tolerant of the rest of us. Tolerance doesn’t mean “I want what I want and you have to accept it!”. If your homes or businesses are picketed or vandalized, we’ll talk again.
The people have spoken, I don’t see McCain supporters rioting. Get over it. If you want to change the benifits of same sex couples change those, don’t force the majority to suit you.
Mick:
Don’t worry about “NoDivorce” who will never answer your questions, even though we answer all of their questions. They are not here for a civil debate.
“Prop. 8 backers complain of ongoing harrassment”
Cry me a river. Good, I hope all the people who supported prop 8 feels the backlash of their hate and lies.
This is what America is about. Taxation without representation will get you another Boston Tea Party. Deal with it.
who has a job on this board
This is an illuminating display of gay/liberal fascism. These people want to force children to be exposed to the gay lifestyle, and have to read books like “Heather Has Two Mommies.” Parents have finally had enough of this being forced upon them. I had no problem with gays until they became militant and began to dictate school curricula. That’s where I draw the line. They have realized that being gay is an evolutionary dead end, so now they want to ensure that kids will be persuaded to join the gay “team.”
Isn’t it great that we live in a country where this issue is on the top of our list of concerns?
No worries that someone is going to wipe out your family for being of the wrong tribe, wrong religion, or political party.
No worries about were you are going to get your next clean glass of drinking water.
No worries about how your wife and daughter can survive in the scrutiny of the religious police.
Propective . . . it’s a good thing.
NoDivorce:
I will not “embrace abortion rights” because of Rudolf. What part of “justified use of force” don’t you understand? Even if it was flour, it is illegal as a terrorist threat.
Oops. . . . that’s “prospective”
johnadams:
As long as it is LEGAL : )
When are you going to protest at the Black or Latino churches? It’s known they voted *YES on 8* in high percentages. What’s stopping you wannabe bullies now, cowardism?
View more acts of cowards here: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=H_ZvPR09N4Q
Sexual Child Molesters will need to be protected under the too. That creepy man just released for sodomy applied at your daughters school is hired because under law he is a class of citizens that wants equal rights for “Children Loving Men”….
Right, because Christians play by the rules? Please. They rape our children and kill our doctors.
Even their hero, elton john, has spoken out against prop 8. he said that he as a civil union with his partner which gives all the rights of a man and a woman. he told the gays to stop pissing off the masses. that it would only result in a huge setback. smart guy elton is!
These election malcontents appear to be nothing better than an army of gay thugs. If they do not get their way, they attack honest citizens in revenge. They sent a white powder to a chuch which had to be assumed as anthrax. These Prop 8 haters are disgusting.
someone tell me where to get the names of shops that supported prop 8
this is beyond ridiculous now! the no on 8 people are sounding like a bunch of spoiled children, like the kid that screamed bloody murder in the toy store because mommy wouldnt buy them a toy. enough already! the people have spoken!
ocobserver:
Just wait until the “National Day of Protest” tomorrow morning 10:30 a.m.
johnadams:
Did I say that Christians shouldn’t obey the law?
Area the moron:
Let’s review who the real terrorists are.
In the U.S., violence directed toward abortion providers has killed 7 people, including 3 doctors, 2 clinic employees, a security guard, and a clinic escort. By Christian groups.
According to statistics gathered by the National Abortion Federation (NAF), an organization of abortion providers, since 1977 in the United States and Canada, there have been 17 attempted murders, 383 death threats, 153 incidents of assault or battery, and 3 kidnappings committed against abortion providers. By Christian groups.
The first letters claiming to contain anthrax were mailed to U.S. clinics in October 1998, a few days after the Slepian shooting, and since then, there have been a total of 655 such bioterror threats made against abortion providers. None of the “anthrax” in these cases was real
According to NAF, since 1977 in the United States and Canada, property crimes committed against abortion providers have included 41 bombings, 173 arsons, 91 attempted bombings or arsons, 619 bomb threats, 1630 incidents of trespassing, 1264 incidents of vandalism, and 100 attacks with butyric acid (”stink bombs”).[8] The first clinic arson occurred in Oregon in March 1976 and the first bombing occurred in February 1978 in Ohio
I love the “Hate” and “Discrimination” polemics by the Prop 8 negs. I throw out the “hate” piece immediately, well mostly because you (the plural you all) don’t have any other tomatoes to throw, and what if “we” did “hate”? Tough luck, you should have voted or thought harder to see the fundamental ethical error of your vote choice like the majority did.
Second, “Discrimination”. Fact - You discriminate against people all the time. My guess is that if you attempted to vote down Prop 8, you feel discriminatory towards anyone who didn’t
Try to refute that proof you Christian terrorists. Look at those numbers. Christians do not play by the rules and I hope the gays follow their lead.
Now the H8ers want to take the rights of gays to protest too. What a bunch of MORONS. This is WAR! All in War is fair as long as its on the right side of the law.
johnadams:
At least we have you “on the record” against bioterror threats : )
I think the no on 8 people are showing their true colors. They are a selfish bunch of cowards. They now want to take away the rights of all the supporters of prop 8. I know it is making me take a stronger stance against them.Let it go to ballot again I would give even more than I did before to make sure marriage is protected. It is between a man and a woman
As I stated, under the law, there is justification for “defense of others” up to and including the use of deadly force to prevent a murder. There is no similar justification for physical and terrorist attacks by your side.
Well, if Prop. 8 is affirmed in court, and this comes up for a vote again (as it well might in 2010), opponents of same-sex marriage are going to have a field day with their ad campaign. The intolerance and vitriolic hatred spewing out of these “protests” is the best argument yet for holding the line here.
The people voted; one side won the other lost. let’s move on. If the losing side wants to spend the money and try to put this on the ballot again for another round of voting, FINE!
Until that vote gets counted and one side is declared the winner, accept the outcome of this vote and follow the law of the land.
More acts of H0M0 cowards here:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=H_ZvPR09N4Q
I’m fine with it if it’s against these violent christians. Mail them all anthrax for all I care. I want to see if God bails them out.
You can’t murder something that is not considered a life. It’s a clump of cells. Thanks for proving that you’re all about violence as long as the Christians are doing it. I hope we see some gay glitter bombs going off in churches around the country soon. That would make my day.
How about you Cecil. Eric Robert Rudolf killed a policeman and maimed a nurse for life from blowing up a clinic.
Does that mean Rudolf automatically represents you? Would his protest cause you to change your core moral beliefs on abortion?
All gay marriage supporters are guilty for the flour episode, while at the same time Rudolf doesn’t represent the views of the anti abortion group. How convenient.
More wonderful waivers you have given yourselves. Bravo.
IDIOTS - yes on passed get over it or get out
The methods of intimidation, the baseless use of harassment, and the threats of boycotting businesses will only serve to enhance public support for the moral definition of marraige. If Prop 8 had not passed, I can guarantee you that none of this action would have ever surfaced from our side against the same sex marraige coalition groups. Did our group protest when the liberal SF judges overturned Prop 22? No–we followed the proper and legal course to make our voices heard and did not harass, intimidate, and threaten boycotts against responssible business persons who voiced THEIR constitutional right.
Now why can’t all you GAY people be like Elton, if anyone should be your role model its him….
you toke away someones civil right to marry. of course the group is going to blacklist, boycott, and protest these people. They have evry right… sorry if you are feeling unpopular now after supporting the hate bill.
and… if a business had a yes on prop 8 sign… I WOULD boycott thier store
johnadams and NoDivorce:
Christians cannot break the law either — I’ve never said otherwise — which is why Eric Robert Rudolph is currently serving five consecutive life sentences in ADX Florence, Colorado.
BTW: I don’t even know if Rudolph is a Christian. Rudolph himself has said he is not and wrote “Many good people continue to send me money and books. Most of them have, of course, an agenda; mostly born-again Christians looking to save my soul. I suppose the assumption is made that because I’m in here I must be a ’sinner’ in need of salvation, and they would be glad to sell me a ticket to heaven, hawking this salvation like peanuts at a ballgame. I do appreciate their charity, but I could really do without the condescension. They have been so nice I would hate to break it to them that I really prefer Nietzsche to the Bible.”
Regardless, in 2005, he pleaded guilty to numerous federal and state homicide charges and accepted his punishment. I hope any homosexual terrorists are similarly hunted down and prosecuted to the fullest extent of the law.
em:
As long as they don’t break the law.
Blue:
The next campaign commericals a writing themselves ; )
Blue, “The intolerance and vitriolic hatred spewing out of these “protests” is the best argument yet for holding the line here.”
Does that mean abortion laws are doomed to stay the same. I mean really. The bombs, the blockades, the posters, the boycotts, the murders.
Gays are quite tame comparative to the abortion anti-protesting nuts.
I just want to say this has nothing to do with religion. Bottom line is that what prop 8 was asking us to do was change everyone mind set, become memorized that there should be a new standard of believing that marriage is between a man and a women.
Bottom line when I voted YES for prop 8, it was because of my belief that marriage is between a man and a women. That I didn’t want this topic to be brought up at schools. I feel 100% that if this passed and in favor of allowing theses marriages, that one day they would be fighting the school districts, going to the supreme courts and asking for teachers and those who teach sex-ed, or teach about marriage, that they need to also include man and man and women and women. My wife and I talked about this and she brought up a good point. Would I rather have a child in a foster home or adopted by loving parents from the same sex. My response to her was that because we don’t know if people are born gay, no scientific facts, or if they turn gay because of their environment it would scare me to think that those children who are taking by these couples would ended up thinking they were gay. Growing up all I knew was my parents, man and women and that is how I grew up. I never had any gay tendencies, I saw my brothers and sisters with girlfriends and boyfriends. It also scares me that in a society we live in that people don’t agree with man and man and women and women that when their kids want to have a sleep over or a birthday party that people wouldn’t send their kids just because they are awkward about the situation that those kids will suffer. And yes as well all know there are people like that and no matter what you are not going to change our minds. Weather this is overturned or not those who voted Yes voted that way for a reason. And if you don’t think that if this gets overturned you won’t have those groups who support Yes take it back to the courts you are crazy. This will be tied up in court for so long that both groups will spend millions of dollars until they win, and by that time no one is going to really care.
Last thing stop talk trash and calling people bigots and saying that we are just like those who caused this great country grief on 9/11, because you have your heads so far up your butts that if you truly believe that, then maybe you are the ones who support those groups. We are Americans and 9/11 has nothing to do with this argument, leave that out, but of course those who voted No feel this is an argument and they have no idea that it just makes them look even stupider then they already do by all the name calling.
Get a life, let the courts decided and stop being so bitter.
I love the “Hate” and “Discrimination” polemics by the Prop 8 negs. I throw out the “hate” piece immediately, well mostly because you (the plural you all) don’t have any other tomatoes to throw, and what if “we” did “hate”? Tough luck, you should have voted or thought harder to see the fundamental ethical error of your vote choice like the majority did.
Second, “Discrimination”. Fact - You discriminate against people all the time. My guess is that if you attempted to vote down Prop 8, you feel discriminatory towards anyone who didn’t (exempli gratia - encouragement towards further intimidation). Also, you discriminate against people based on their age. You believe 4 year should not be allowed to attain a drivers license. You discriminate against people based on their ability. You don’t go to the barber who is losing his eyesight. You discriminate against people based on their finances. You walk right by that dirty homeless person asking you for change, thinking “I MADE my money, you can work for yours too”.
So if by saying that the state of California is Discriminating against homosexuals, then I say, yes, you are correct. In the same manner that discernment must be made in all kinds of matters, the state cannot grant open season rights to all who demand it. How would the Homosexual community respond to all 9 year olds in California demanding their RIGHTS to drink alcohol and drive motor vehicles? An entire class of citizens would probably be discriminated against. Why? For the betterment of the whole. And yes, the 9 year olds would be angry and throw tantrums in the streets because they just don’t understand. But the collective wisdom, the higher wisdom knows better.
(yes - I just compared 9 year old tantrums with what I’ve seen in the streets) - I am sure this is all that will be heard here unfortunately.
privileges vs rights in the next post…
Marriage, like Driver’s Licenses, are NOT CIVIL RIGHTS!
You H0M0s didn’t lose your civil rights.
Marriage is between a Man and a Woman.
Look in the dictionary you sore losers.
Where IS your intolerance to the majority??
So much for TOLERANCE………..
These anti H8 protest are hurting their cause. I’d like to hear anti-8 backers stand up against this behavior.
lets boycott all the business’s that supported No on 8 and harass them in the same way, in todays business climate I’m sure all the no on 8 backers will feel the sting of us not using their business’s.
OOOOOOOOO:
Name-calling won’t help either.
“No On 8″ supporters…….Get Over It, you lost. And stop saying that it’s about “their” civil rights. Being gay is not a right….it’s a choice. And why is it that the gay community and those against Prop 8 are so violent?? You know, if you build a home(family) on sand it is going to sink and fall apart.
Abortion issue = RED HERRING
And I am pro-choice, by the way.
Being of sane mind, not biased either way regarding prop 8, I feel that there is a fundamental argument being missed; especially by people of faith (Christians). First, marriage is a three way contract between two individuals and the state; the state of California in this case. Marriage within the church is simply “smoke and mirrors” surrounding the “official” marriage; the signing of legal documents binding the couple in a contract with the state, not the church. So I argue that this is indeed a civil matter and any “not for profit” entity that uses it influent on its parishioners to manipulate them to vote, one way or the other, on ANY proposition should have their non-profit status revoked. It is shameful that any group of people could invoke the “Mob Mentality” to strip rights away from their fellow AMERICANS; SHAME ON YOU. Maybe we should start persecuting Christians see how they feel about being singled out simply because of their belief; however misguided. I guess that there will always be some group getting persecuted in the American society and any minority that supports this proposition should be ASHAMED of themselves; the people whose shoulders you are standing on are embarrassed on account of your actions. Maybe one day we can respect each other and not pass judgment; hum, where have I heard that statement before, oh that’s right, Christians. Hypocrisy is alive and well, if you don’t believe that, you haven’t gone to church lately; you heathen.
I feel very good about my decision, and I stand by it. Being in the majority does not make me feel “unpopular”. Neither would it concen me if I were in the minority. I truly respect gay people and have associated with many of them. I feel bad that I did not contribute any money to the cause, but maybe I can be tracked down and harassed anyhow. I can assure you that I have not and never will do these kinds of things to any gay person, even if and when the court overturns what I feel is the moral and constitutional definition of marriage.
typical scumbag tactics you would expect from these leftist groups
“Last I checked, incest involves CHILDREN! ”
huh? dude go to dictionary.com… you need serious help grasping the language
to: G
G for gay??? hmm
anyway religion was used to pass this stupid ballot. Since the catholic church can not donate money on its own, they used the knights of colombus and mormon opposed because of their religious beliefe, how is it NOT about religion? People voting on their religion belief and not about whats wrong or right. like i said if its not for you then leave it alone. Let other people live their life.
Remember everyone, the gay marriage issue is settled!!!!
Of course your very own “settled issue” gets one of your conservative waivers.
Even though the Supreme Court settled the abortion issue YEARS ago, you have pretty much given yourselves the right to even more ridiculous in your face protests!
I think drivers license should state wether your gay or not just like your gender…. and all
So, ocvoice, what would you say about christian groups bombing clinics and killing people for their beliefs? Are those leftist also? You’re a freaking idiot, seriously.
I’m shocked! I thought the Gay agenda was all about rights and treating people justly…..
Hmm go figure. Hey! maybe they are not the people they have pretended to be…
“johnadams Says:
November 14th, 2008 at 12:19 pm
Right, because Christians play by the rules? Please. They rape our children and kill our doctors.”
feeble argument at best… very, very weak. by the way, who’s “our”?
also makes me wonder what doctor “you” are going to when you get a sore throat. quite interesting
As for “gay glitter bombs going off in churches” or other disruptions:
California Penal Code Sec. 423.2. Every person who, except a parent or guardian acting towards his or her minor child or ward, commits any of the following acts shall be subject to the punishment specified in Section 423.3.
(b) By force, threat of force, or physical obstruction that is a
crime of violence, intentionally injures, intimidates, interferes
with, or attempts to injure, intimidate, or interfere with any person
lawfully exercising or seeking to exercise the First Amendment right
of religious freedom at a place of religious worship.
…
(d) By nonviolent physical obstruction, intentionally injures,
intimidates, or interferes with, or attempts to injure, intimidate,
or interfere with, any person lawfully exercising or seeking to
exercise the First Amendment right of religious freedom at a place of
religious worship.
…
(f) Intentionally damages or destroys the property of a place of
religious worship.
(There are also civil remedies ; )
what’s so ironic and amazing is how the defeatists with their cute little “H8″ symbols are the ones behaving as screaming children so full of vitriol and hate. really disturbing
Elton John on Prop 8
November 12, 2008
By By Donna Freydkin
USA TODAY
NEW YORK — Sir Elton John, accompanied by his longtime partner David Furnish, had some choice words about California’s Proposition 8, the ban on same-sex marriage that passed on Nov. 4.
In December 2005, John and Furnish tied the knot in a civil partnership ceremony in Windsor, England. But, clarified the singer, “We’re not married. Let’s get that right. We have a civil partnership. What is wrong with Proposition 8 is that they went for marriage. Marriage is going to put a lot of people off, the word marriage.”
John and Furnish, and their two cocker spaniels Marilyn and Arthur, were in town for Monday’s annual benefit for the Elton John AIDS Foundation.
“I don’t want to be married. I’m very happy with a civil partnership. If gay people want to get married, or get together, they should have a civil partnership,” said John. “The word marriage, I think, puts a lot of people off. You get the same equal rights that we do when we have a civil partnership. Heterosexual people get married. We can have civil partnerships.”
Finally someone who gets it!!
Now the gays are sending fake Antrax letters to Mormon churches:
http://apnews.myway.com/article/20081114/D94EEP9O2.html
How come you gays don’t do anything towards Blacks or Latinos? It’s known how they supported Yes on 8?
Seems like your gays are fake tough guys. Truly cowards.
Yes on Prop 8
Ongoing harassment?
Violence is always a great response
I will be boycotting any businesses that have made pro 8 donations. It’s my right to spend my money where I want. My partner I make over 300k a years but not a penny of that will go to the H8TERS. The pro 8 people on this site are the dregs of our community and are what keep us as a society moving backwards. OUT LAW Divorce if you want to protect marriage so much. Keep religion out of government.
bpsqwerty:
I’m not gay. Ask your wife.
jorants:
You mean like Apple Computers?
U R mean john adams.
anyone can say they r a christian group.
i dont support abortion clinic bombing.
u support anthrax mailings…
u r a clump of cells. r u alive?
Any Yes on 8 supporter who thinks that because bigotry and hate passed by a VERY SLIM margin, that this issue will go quietly into the night, will be sorely mistaken.
andy:
If we can’t even make a same-sex marriage ban stick, how exactly are we going to repeal no-fault divorce laws?
Hey - guess what?
It’s a free country. If they want to protest and not give their money to companies or people that donated to Yes on 8, more power to them.
The Yes on 8 people shouldn’t whine about it. They’ll probably fund another proposition to make protesting illegal in the next election.
john adams wants a civil war. i hope he doesn’t want bloodshed. we had one already and it cost many lives.
does anyone play by the rules anymore? no. when we have laws to let criminals off easy cuz it’s not their fault. they were born that way.
Tina, that very slim margin that 8 PASSED is the same margin that Obama beat McCain in a LANDSLIDE!
How strange it is that you would try and mislead on this topic.
BTW, Marriage is between a Man and a Woman in case you can’t find your dictionary. : )
1) The No on 8 people can challenge in court, but they will lose. The only initiative in California history that was ruled a REVISION of the state constitution as opposes to an AMENDMENT contained THOUSANDS OF WORDS AND MULTIPLE SECTIONS. Prop 8 contains a MERE 14 OPERABALE WORDS. It’s not even a close call. But they can try.
Whatever the cause of homosexuality – be it genetic, environmental, or whatever – I empathize with those who feel this and especially those who valiantly struggle to resist this urge. Some here and elsewhere have said that they would not “choose homosexuality”, that it is not their choice and that it has been a difficult way to live. I empathize. I can only imagine based on my observations and my own struggles that homosexual tendencies (chose a different word if you want) are extremely difficult to live with and to overcome. I wish you no ill.
.
2) Whether or not it is the agenda of the gay community in general to force teaching of gay marriage in the schools, it will happen if we allow gay “marriage”. Soon after gay “marriage” becomes established in California, at least one gay person (and one is all it will take) will sue claiming discrimination because their first-grade child’s textbooks, story books, etc. have stories based around heterosexual married couples (something like “Mr. and Mrs. Jones owned a farm …”) but not based on a gay couple (”Mister and Mister Jones …). They will sue because, as they claim, gay marriage is a “fundamental right”, and to exclude it from the curriculum is a violation of that right. AND THEY WILL WIN.
.
3) The same logic applied to my comment #2 above will apply in many aspects of life to numerous to list, or even to imagine.
.
4) NATURE has determined that children are born to HETEROSEXUALS ( or at least those who partake in heterosexual activity). If RELIGION happens to agree with NATURE, that hardly changes NATURE or is the fault of religion. Sorry, Prop 8 opponents, but it is those who wish to pretend that homosexual activity (activity that CANNOT produce offspring) is equivalent to heterosexual activity. This fantasy is AT ODDS WITH NATURE. That seems obvious enough.
.
5) Californians have already bent over backwards ( no pun intended, but accidental pun kind of funny) to give those who chose to live homosexual lifestyles rights equivalent to married couples. To the extent, if any, that this is not true most of even those who voted in favor of Prop 8 support this. I support it, but I’m beginning to have second thoughts about that. “Give an inch …”
.
6) Where a radical change in the basic structure of society is proposed, the burden to show that the change is beneficial is on he who favors the change and NOT on he who favors the status quo. In this case, it will take at least one generation (the period of time to see the results of legally sanctioned gay marriages) of experimentation to see the effects of the proposed change. Massachusetts, with a population of 6 million provides a testing population more than large enough for the experiment without risking the bulk of this United States of America and its great society on the experiment.
.
7) I would be surprised that more than a very small percentage of even homosexuals would believe that the BEST, HEALTHIEST AND MOST IDEAL HOME for a child is that of a LOVING MOTHER AND FATHER. Although many homes fall short of this for lack of love, a mother, or a father, it remains the BEST, HEALTHIEST AND MOST IDEAL. This is what the word “MARRIAGE” represents. Sorry, homosexuals, but the best you can provide within a homosexual relationship is less than the best possible. It is in the INTEREST OF SOCIETY AND CHILDREN to uphold “MARRIAGE” as this BEST, HEALTHIEST, AND MOST IDEAL HOME.
.
JakeD that’s very funny because just a few minutes ago there was a comment saying it was all within the law!! hmmmm amazing
FormerFan:
PLEASE cancel you subscription, and don’t buy print copies, of the OC Register! You can get all the news you need on-line. We would ALL do that to protest.
Thanks Scottie………I guess what she doesn’t understand is that it “PASSED”.
Nice to see the Protester are out at the Doubletree protesting the H8ers.
Right on andy!
God created “Adam and Eve”
NOT
“Adam, Eve, then Stephanie”
Divorce is a choice!
Tina:
Over 500,000 votes (and still counting) is hardly a “slim” margin.
How well did one million illegals taking to the streets, waving Mexican flags, and demanding citizenship work for that movement?
The protesters may want to be a lttle careful around Mormon churches. Some of them have a large Somoan population. These guys are warriors, and make ultimate fighters look like sissies.
To All…
Read what Elton John has to say!
“And they say they won’t take this to the schools. this is a very selfish movement. they will destroy anyone who has a different opinion than their own. they want tolerance yet they show no tolerance themselves. - Iou”
You sound just like you’re from the South around 1965. Perhaps you were there? Either that or you are to young to know what fighting for a Civil Right is?
512,371 (to be precise) as of 10:22 a.m.
The sad thing about all this is that I believe gays will now lose the empathy and support that they have gained over the last couple of decades. In short, if you constantly harass people, accusing them of hating you, they will indeed eventually hate you. You are not only failing to gain what what you want, you are losing what you have.
For all you bringing up polygamy and incest, your argument is moot. There is not a large group of people trying to make polygamy or incest legal in California. I don’t know of any individuals that want more than one spouse or wants to marry a sibling. I do know many gays, family and friends, who are in relationships that are more loving and inspirational than many straight ones. I think we should cherish and celebrate these relationships. I pity those of you that are so cold-hearted that you laugh at this shameful vote, teasing and taunting those who just got a precious right taken away. You are sad, sad people.
This issue will be decided in the court of law. Just like the Jim Crow laws had to be ruled illegal by the courts the rights of gays will be decided by the courts.
GT - Gay Marriage is not a Civil Right. Maybe you gave too many BJ’s and now have brain damage? Show your tollerance and accept the will of the people.
Marriage is between a Man and a Woman.
Depeche Mode Says:
November 14th, 2008 at 11:27 am
Ha! let them boycott and intimidate all they want. Its hilarious. Why should we care? Imagine how much easier it will be to support marriage when this comes up on the ballot again? Just keep showing commercials of all the rioting and hate. done.
———–
Did you feel the same way when the blacks demanded equal rights in the 60’s with boycotts and protests? This should not be about religion or being gay, discrimination in any way, shape, or form is wrong.
“I’m not gay. Ask your wife.”
neither is Anne Heche… but she used to be. nor do I have a wife
Irving:
That’s not a “sad” thing at all.
“Just like the Jim Crow laws had to be ruled illegal by the courts the rights of gays will be decided by the courts.”
newsflash, gays CAN use white drinking fountains! they can also have civil unions, vote, and hold public office. they lost this vote.
Scottie:
Over 6,184,393 Californians voted for Prop. 8. Are they going to boycott us all?
Christians need to get over themselves and understand the book they hold so dear is nothing more than a twist on paganism.
Is the same true with abortion protest Irving? Some of the protests are pretty sick. Does this mean abortion laws will never be changed?
What kind of protest would make you switch to the other side Irving? Would it be the bombs? The assassinations? The posters? The blockades?
Any of you ever say “That’s it I’m through with these tactics, I now support abortion.”
Homosexuals are not helping themselves by these violent actions. Furthermore, they seem even more unstable and non-sensicle when they compare there need for social legitimization for their gay lifestyles’ by comparing their plight to those of black Americans and their quest for civil rights.
By the way no on 8 supporters, those same African Americans who demanded and fought for their civil rights voted 70% to 30% against allowing homosexual marriage. Which was the determent factor in 8’s passing. Why, are you not protesting the black church? I think we all know the answer to that one don’t we! Homosexuality is a immoral and perverse lifestyle choice pure and simple that the vast majority of America disagrees with.
I probably won’t boycott businesses that supported “No on 8″, but I will go out of my way to support businesses targeted by homosexuals.
21st century witch hunt!!
It’s kind of funny that when they were campaigning. Yes on 8 and protectmarriage.com would send of letters demanding that companies and organizations that donated to No On 8 should “correct there error” by donating an equal amount to Yes On 8 or be exposed (Not that that is a huge deal since those records are open to the public anyway).
But now that Prop 8 passed and No On 8 supporters are boycotting businesses that supported Yes on 8, they suddenly feel the need to condemn such actions. The hypocrisy of Yes On 8 has honestly been one of the most amusing things that I have seen in quite awhile.
(again)
Threats from gays? LOL! Let the the 2% boycott. Who will lose money? Whole Foods? Apple Computer? IKEA? Volvo? KY?
I don’t see how it would affect me.
R.L.:
Which is why I want MORE media coverage of these protests ; )
The church is hiding behind “morality” to support their bigotry and hate. In South OC they had jr high and high school kids out protesting. They don’t want their kids taught about gay marriage but it’s OK to teach them how to hate minorities.
Tina:
Are you still there?
6.2 MILLION voters (last time I checked).
funny I thought IKEA made a huge effort to hire gays and be a nice little place for them to work. have you been to their store in the last year…? it’s like a parade at the checkouts, I’m surprised they don’t sell rainbow flags. but now maybe we know why Apple got rid of their rainbow logo. it’s all making sense now. guess it’s time for all of them to switch to Dell and Microsoft.
It’s pretty interesting that a majority of Republican appointed judges carrying out their sworn duty to interpret the Consitution and protect the rights of the minority are vilified by the religious right. Judges have always been called upon the protect the minority. The pro-Prop 8 people are the same type of bigots who would have been screaming 40+ years ago about the courts ruling against bans on inter-racial marriage. Remember, we are talking about CIVIL marriage, not a religious expression. And for those who feel a need to “protect marriage”, then how about getting behind an effort to bad divorce?
bpsqwerty, NEWFLASH!!!
RICHARD PERRY LOVING et ux., Appellants,
v.
VIRGINIA
388 US 1, 18 L ed 2d 1010, 87 S Ct 1817
Argued April 10, 1967. Decided June 12, 1967.
“This case presents a constitutional question never addressed by this Court: whether a statutory scheme adopted by the State of Virginia to prevent marriages between persons solely on the basis of racial classifications violates the Equal Protection and Due Process Clauses of the Fourteenth Amendment. For reasons which seem to us to reflect the central meaning of those constitutional commands, we conclude that these statutes cannot stand consistently with the Fourteenth Amendment.”
input the word(s) sexual orientation or gender specific in place of race to get a better under standing of what how the 14th Adm. will apply in this case.
http://www.ameasite.org/loving.asp
“In God We Trust” is printed on every dollar bill. Anti prop 8 better start exchanging those for pesos, yens, whatever. Even the dollars disagree with you.
The rioting and hate is being perpetrated by those who protest against Prop 8. At least one woman was physically assaulted last week at the Mormon temple in LA when she tried to remove the protesters signs from the temple’s fence. The police had to move their vehicle to inside of the gates for fear that the animals would damage them.
nobody took anybody’s rights away. the People voted on the definition of Marriage.
it’s about states rights…..VA matters not. I’m not clicking on your “loving” site. no way…
Warren:
Leave it to your side to “input” something where it never was intended to go in the first place ; )
Why not protest facts like my neighbors make more money than me? Seriously, these cry whiners need to shut up and move on. I don’t give a damn about basic rights. YOU LOST. BETTER LUCK IN 4 YEARS!! Thats like the whining kid crying about I lost at something. Welcome to reality, life sucks, you do what you can as best as you can, move on. You don’t change the rules just because you lost. They want to play mind games and intimidate because they are sore losers here’s one.
Chickens won! they have more rights than you! HA!!!
Free range chickens. Woohoo!!!
Wait…the chickens might see this post and now cry and complain. Then we’ll have chickens marching, protesting, and intimidating people!
Interracial arguments don’t apply. Those are still between a man and a woman. It did not redefine the entire institute of marriage.
Has anyone seen a serge of hetro marriages or a downturn in the divorce rate due to this vote? I’m really curious to see how this has protected marriage.
No Divorce -
I’ve always supported abortion,………as long as it’s not paid for by federal, state, county, or city TAXPAYERS DOLLARS!!!!i
Michael:
If we can’t even make a same-sex marriage ban stick, how exactly are we going to repeal no-fault divorce laws?
I hope someone burns all you gay people, we all know your going to hell anyway might as well get a jumpstart
It’s funny that two weeks before the election that ProtectMarriage.com and Yes On 8 attempted to extort companies and organizations that backed No On 8. Were they “kindly” asked for those companies and organizations to correct there error and donate to Yes On 8 a, or else they would be exposed.
Now that Prop 8 passed and the exact same thing happened to the companies and organization that backed Yes on 8, they are suddenly crying fowl. Honestly the hypocrisy behind Yes On 8 and ProtectMarriage.com can only be described as absolutely phenomenal.
Let them keep acting like children with the violent and threatening protest, and if we ever have to vote on it again the percentage will be much higher on the YES side. They’re just helping their oppositions cause.
Wanna see a crowd of *GAY COWARDS* attack an old lady?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=H_ZvPR09N4Q
Gays need to get their A$$es of the street and go back to the closet where they belong!
Its time people. Its obvious that a far reaching Christian conspiracy has set out to turn back California law and then remake our laws to conform to their Bible.
In the last poll 65% of all California approve of Roe v Wade and don’t want to see it overturned. This is a super-majority. We need to make sure our view of supporting abortion rights stand, no matter what people may think in the future, or how courts rule in the future.
If we vote now we can make safe abortion an option FOREVER.
Lets not take any chances. States have put anti-gay amendments in place where they weren’t yet needed.
Lets do the same with abortion. Lets make it legal under the state constitution by ballot, before they try and take that away, they probably feel emboldened now. They have crazy, lying campaigners and would be hard to beat.
Please vote to keep abortion legal! Vote YES on the abortion amendment.
Please provide a list of boycotted businesses so that I know where to do my Thanksgiving and Christmas shopping.
Gays are the NEW terrorists and should be eliminated.
Scottie:
Wow.
Hey Scottie, so BJs cause brain damage? I’m guessing you hate women as much as you hate gays. Does your -happily married I assume- father say that to your mother? Do you say that to your wife? “Honey, all those bjs have given you brain damage.” What a lovely family you must have.
in that video the one h0mo tells the reporter repeatedly “as an Asian chick you should understand” and “as an Asian chick you should go home” I don’t know too many women who like being called a chick. It’s sad to see desperate people use childish and transparent manipulation. What losers.
Also, look how they use the No on 8 signs as a cover up their actions.
Video: a crowd of *GAY COWARDS* attack an old lady?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=H_ZvPR09N4Q
NoDivorce:
Did you watch that poor old lady getting attacked?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=H_ZvPR09N4Q
FYI: abortion-on-demand is already in the California Constitution.
doesnt meant your not murderers
Just as long as abortion is NOT paid for by federal, state, county, or city TAXPAYERS DOLLARS, No Divorce!!!!
Without it,….I don’t approve!!!
Say whatever you want about people who supported Prop 8. I supported Prop 8 and I will do it again on the next ballot. Stop accusing us of being religious and discriminating. First of all, I am not religious and don’t even go to church. I don’t have a problem with gay people, they can do whatever they want in their personal lives. It’s fortunate enough that gay people are being widely accepted now compared to the 80s. You can’t have everything your way.
You people jam up traffic during rush hour and being inconsiderate. I am glad I voted YES!
burn all gay people theyre going to hell anyway
nm, actually not many retail businesses supported 8, it was mostly real estate companies. Guess you can buy some houses.
bigutsss:
There’s no need for violence from either side.
Verra
I think “crying fowl” was Prop. 2 ; )
Carla, I am with the majority. If you want to prove excessive BJ’s don’t cause brain damage I am sure we can arrange a meeting of a few hundred men to line up in front of you. What to you say? Are you willing to open up for research?
History is an indicater to what will happen in the future. We all know that.
44 of 50 states now have laws about traditional marriage. History shows that all states allowed segregation of blacks and did not allow women to vote. Today every state in the nation now has law to ban segregation of any race and women are able to vote even able to run for the highest office in the nation, The Presidency of the United States of America.
Remember that we now have a black man that will be our nex President.
John:
If you like Tex Mex food and are ever by Hollywood, let me know ; )
Scottie LMFAOI
Yes on Prop. 8 = 6,190,409 (as of 1:22 p.m.) and still counting . . .
Yea,……that was a good one, Scottie.
Just as I suspected Scottie. This isn’t about love and marriage. Its about people feeling superior and part of the “moral majority” because they maintain the view that women are the ones who are supposed to suck dick. How beautiful and eloquent you “protectors of marriage are.
Carla - let’s see how intelligent and superior you sound after you give your 100th BJ. And, I will personally give you a *Pearl*Necklace* for your efforts.
Depeche Mode Says:
November 14th, 2008 at 11:27 am
Ha! let them boycott and intimidate all they want. Its hilarious. Why should we care? Imagine how much easier it will be to support marriage when this comes up on the ballot again? Just keep showing commercials of all the rioting and hate. done.
I agree to keep showing the commercial and rioting and hate. That only shows the people are not satisfied with Prop 8. All the publicity only helps people to realize that fact and are joining to support No on 8.
Great comments Depeche mode.
Is the anti-Mormon protest in Newport Beach by the church across from the Lutheran one in Castaways?
Scottie,……..you said a few hundred,………….not just one hundred!!!
This is why as a straight teenager I left Christianity, and why I side with gay rights. Anti-gay views are directly linked to hatred and disrespect of women. Congratulations, I can’t wait to show this to my mom, who is starting to see my side and leave the church as well.
Carla - Now you are talking too much and we know that’s not what your mouth is for. It’s time for you to earn that *Pearl*Necklace*
Actually, I’m typing. And don’t get me wrong, I love giving BJs to boys who are pro-gay marriage, — they are waaaay hotter then their hateful brethren.
Jake read the post! I want a preemptive amendment in the state constitution that gives a women the right to an abortion. Just in case the Supreme Court over-rules R v W. States do it all the time. They are doing it now with preemptive gay marriage amendments. Just-in-casers.
I know it would be a risk. The tactics used by the anti abortion crowd would be terroristic. Bombs, blockades, assassination. And much more.
It needs to be done now, while two-thirds of the state still supports abortion. Support for an abortion ban is growing everyday. They’re catching up. Just like gay marriage supporters were catching up with the anti crowd. Timing is everything.
BTW Jake, do you think abortion is settled law?
JakeD,
A lot of straight guys “input” it in the same place with women. Furthermore, a lot of “straight” guys do things behind closed doors then return home to their wife and kids.
South Dakota couldn’t even win an abortion ban. Please. You women haters are so naive.
Carla, I’m am not surprised in your response. But, the “boys” part sounds illegal and a bit sick. You should get some help and stop trying to re-live your pathetic youth.
Your fading Scottie. Why don’t you have mommy or wifey take over? I’d love to hear what the women in you life think of your comments.
For those who don’t think that marriage is NOTA RIGHT I suggest you stop thinking with your feelings and read the law:
In re Marriage Cases, (S147999)
Opinion (PDF) - May 15, 2008
http://www.courtinfo.ca.gov/opinions/archive/S147999.PDF
http://www.courtinfo.ca.gov/courts/supreme/highprofile/
Carla - does your preying on boys make you feel like a powerful woman? Or are you so ugly that no man shows you interest so now you dress like a man to attract equally disgusting lesbian man-chicks?
Oops I meant “you are”. Damn those BJs!!!
And yes, my youth was pathetic. I grew up in orange county.
NoDivorce:
I would be happy to answer your questions, just as soon as you answer mine from before (”did you watch the old lady getting attacked?”)
Warren:
I suggest you read the recently AMENDED California Constitution ; )
“No one in California political circles has ever seen such a speedy response to a single political event. And it’s spreading across the country. More than 10,000 rallied in New York City on Wednesday evening…” — San Jose Mercury News, November 13
New thread (let’s give Scottie and Carla a little privacy ; )
http://totalbuzz.freedomblogging.com/2008/11/14/prop-8-leaders-portray-foes-as-an-angry-dangerous-mob/8384/
I’m so sure any of you care about old ladies. I haven’t read anything remotely positive about women from the yes on h8ters. Admit it JakeD you are just treating this thing like a sports show. This has nothing to do with respect for women.
Warren:
Let me know when you get over a million marching in downtown L.A. like the illegals did right before the amnesty bill vote.
Jake,
I suggest you read the controlling case law on what is an amendment vs revision:
Raven, 52 Cal. 3d at 350
great piece. but you forget to mention something else i read on another website: “The California Supreme Court has held that the difference between an amendment and a revision turns on both “quantitative and qualitative” factors, and that “substantial changes in either respect could amount to a revision.” Raven, 52 Cal. 3d at 350. Thus, even if we thought that Prop 8 affected relatively few constitutional provisions (say, the state’s equal protection and due-process guarantees), changes to these provisions might be regarded as “substantial qualitative” reforms in the content of basic constitutional principles.”
Carla - Really, seek help. It’s never too late.
Carla:
Did you mean to ask Scottie that question? I’ve been married to the same woman for almost 45 years and have nothing but respect for the Bearers of Human Life.
Warren:
I’ve read that case.
Congrats Jake! Then answer me this, how has the marriages of gays in California hurt your marriage?
All of the hateful name calling and activity on both sides needs to stop. That’s no way for people to behave and there is a lot of wrong going on on both sides of the fence. Violence and threats are not the answer but peaceful protesting, picketing and boycotting are within each group’s legal right.
I think we all need to start trying to understand how we can resolve the situation. There has to be a middle ground somewhere. Perhaps in the separation of the term marriage and civil union? In my mind, “marriage” is a religious sacrament that is performed according to religious beliefs, where a “civil union” is the legal binding of two people. I’m straight and getting married next year and will have to have a court approve our legal union and a church perform our marriage, so in my mind there is a difference.
Personally, I’m no on prop 8 because I believe that people should be able to legally bind themselves to whoever they choose as long as the other person is a conscenting adult and able to make a sane decision (which is why we go get the court license). As for the religious “marriage”, I think that’s up to religions to choose what they believe and practice that. They shouldn’t be judged for doing so, either. You don’t like it - don’t join their religion.
The hateful acts by some (and it’s very, very few in comparison to the millions of no on 8 backers) must stop and those conducting them should be arrested and tried for their crimes. I peacefully pledge to continue supporting no on 8 but I also support the rights of the yes on 8 people to have their opinion and beliefs.
Not my marriage, specifically (unless they succeed in getting California out of the “marriage” license business altogether). The future negative impact on individuals, families, communities, and society at large is my concern.
Worse case scenario, Carla, if everyone enters into a same-sex marriage, civilization ceases to exist within a generation. Did you see that movie: “Children of God”?
Sorry, “Children of Men”.
Roseskier:
So, according to your logic, an adult brother should be allowed to marry his adult sister? How about polygamy too?
Carla - Do you commonly ask questions out of the blue? Marriage is between a Man and a Woman. Any change in this negatively changes marriage.
Upload a pick of yourself, we want to see your not a disgustingly ugly lesbian man-chick. Or, past the link here.
Jake, I’m doing my protesting by emails. I’ve already contacted my Representatives to express my beliefs why we need to start working on over turning the Defense of Marriage Act. With the Dems in control of the house and senate and Obama in the House, a Change is going to come. I’m very confident that the CA Supreme Court will over turn H8. My belief is based on reading the case law and “In re Marriage Cases, (S147999). ”
Here’s another case you can read about when Deukmejian wanted to over turn the Raven ruling:
Raven v. Deukmejian (1990) 52 Cal.3d 336, 350, 276 Cal.Rptr. 326, 801 P.2d 1077 (Raven
Warren:
That’s the same case cite.
Roseskier,
I agree with you on two counts:
.
1) This thread has gotten quite nasty. Scottie, in particular, should be ashamed of himself.
.
2) We should reach a compromise. In fact, we already have. It’s called “civil unions” for homosexual couples. Unfortunately no compromise will ever be accepted by the Gay Agenda.
So you are doing this for us? The youth? For families? For civilization? Well I got news for you…the youth want our gay kin to marry, as they eventually will because the youth are becoming more an more tolerant. As for families, I know many gay parents, mostly those who foster. If anything gay marriage would benefit those families. And as for civilization, well, if everyone in the future goes gay, and stops reproducing, that’s gonna happen whether its legal or not!
Carla - found your pic here:
http://www.geocities.com/mxpxboy_mike/man_chick.jpg
You first Scottie. And wifey too.
Jake, Children of Men had nothing in it about gays. If anything it was about war and pollution, and what happens when humans stop looking out for each other.
And, stop having babies (my “worse case scenario” above : )
FYI: The Mormon church issued a press release on the topic.
http://newsroom.lds.org/ldsnewsroom/eng/news-releases-stories/first-presidency-urges-respect-civility-in-public-discourse
Repost:
Look how they use the No on 8 signs to cover up their hate-inspired actions.
Video: a crowd of *GAY COWARDS* attacking an old lady, how sad and desperate:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=H_ZvPR09N4Q
So now we are just reposting old comments? Man you guys are flailing. Still haven’t been convinced 8 is about love and marriage. Just a bunch of boys taking a dump on women and gays.
News Flash:
Rick Warren at Saddleback Church already tried to have a “civil forum” during the election, and look what that got him.
JakeD - If there were a private message option, I’d send you my thoughts on that. I will say though, that as hard as it would be, if a family member of mine engaged in either of those things you asked about, I would love them still with my whole heart even though I wouldn’t personally agree with that decision. In terms of legal rights, I think there’s not a large enough population of either to bring that to the forefront but I guess we’d vote on that too if there was.
What I was trying to say I guess is that I’m just a person, flawed and not perfect, but I don’t feel that I have the right to judge others based on my own personal beliefs.
I’m not a lawyer, nor do I really understand all of the details of the law which you seem to know quite well, but I know people and I know that even in the toughest situations, we can all work together and find a solution if we really commit ourselves to it. And that MUST be done peacefully.
LMAO!!! You call that an attack!!! What a crybaby. She got shouted down. Oh the humanity!!!
Look kiddies. An attack is a policeman getting killed and a nurse getting her face blown up by an anti-abortion protester. An attack is a gay man left for dead as a scarecrow.
Some of you are very weak. Just think if they were using anti abortion methods on you. LMAO.
Roseskier:
It’s obvious they WON’T let it go peacefully.
NoDivorce:
If I grab a cross out of your hand, that’s an assault and battery.
You thought that Gavin “Whether you like it or not!” Newsome commerical was effective …
Carla - That video of gay cowards attacking an old white lady is priceless. I see that you are now posting your words in other peoples mouths. How desperate. Your mouth is good for one thing and it’s not communicating.
Remember, Marriage is between a Man and a Woman. If you happen to forget or are unsure, you can always use a dictionary.
John - I think that you might be right on #2, but part of that might be because we look at hetero “marriage” as different from a “civil union”. What I’m saying is hold everyone to the same process - “marriage” in a church and “civil union” for legal binding. So hetero couples that don’t get married in a church would then also have a “domestic partnership” or “civil union” or whatever it is. Exclusionary language may be more of a problem than the law itself - although I’m not a lawyer so there may be other legal differences between a “civil union” and a “marriage”. Actually, if someone could educate me a little on that, I’d be appreciative!
NoDivorce - why don’t you gays go to a Black church in Los Angeles and pull some of these tactics. I’m sure that video will clearly show what an “attack” looks like. Oh that’s right, you gays are too cowardly to do something so direct to those who actually help pass Prop 8!
According to the In Re Marriage Cases (May 15, 2008) 2008 WL 2051892: “Although our state Constitution does not contain any explicit reference to a “right to marry,” past California cases establish beyond question that the right to marry is a fundamental right whose protection is guaranteed to all persons by the California Constitution…. In light of the fundamental nature of the substantive rights embodied in the right to marry - and their central importance to an individual’s opportunity to live a happy, meaningful, and satisfying life as a full member of society - the California Constitution properly must be interpreted to guarantee this basic civil right to all individuals and couples, without regard to their sexual orientation. ”
The proposed initiative originally sought to limit the Constitutional right to marry to opposite sex couples and, thus as originally drafted, it was intended to limit the right to marry to a man and a woman. But an amendment can no longer accomplish this. The Right to Marry exists and in light of the recent ruling, the initiative’s unintended consequence is an attempt to revise (as opposed to amend) the Constitution which, as explained in In Re Marriage Cases (May 15, 2008) 2008 WL 2051892, is a fundamental Constructional right to “all individuals and couples, without regard to their sexual orientation.”
“Whether an initiative constitutes an amendment or revision to the Constitution does not necessarily depend on the number of constitutional provisions it affects, but on the nature of the changes it makes. (Grodin et al., The California State Constitution: A Reference Guide, supra, at pp. 303-304.) For a revision to be found, “it must necessarily or inevitably appear from the face of the challenged provision that the measure will substantially alter the basic governmental framework set forth in our Constitution.” See California Assn. of Retail Tobacconists v. State of California (2003) 109 Cal.App.4th 792, 833-834 (quote set forth more fully below).
http://www.metnews.com/articles/2008/inmyopinion052108.htm
Jake, I just proved all your reasons for voting on 8 to be moot. Just admit it, you like feeling superior and denying someone else’s rights has brought some sort of excitement to your life.
The REAL people that harass CITIZENS going about there democratic rights are YES ON 8.
Near the end of the election Yes on 8 sent letters DEMANDING that supporters to No on 8 make an equal monetary CONTRIBUTION to their side.
Check out the link:
http://www.goodasyou.org/good_as_you/2008/11/just-so-all-you.html
Also, MARRIAGE is a CIVIL RIGHT. The Supreme Court of the US found that in Loving vs. Virgina.
They found that:
“Marriage is one of the “basic civil rights of man,” fundamental to our very existence and survival….”
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Loving_v_virginia
One final thing Nearly all SCIENTIFIC studies have found that children of same-sex couples are the same as heterosexual couples.
http://www.apa.org/pi/lgbc/policy/parentschildren.pdf
Roseskier:
There are THOUSANDS of federal benefits afforded to “marriage” that are precluded to “domestic partnerships”.
Carla:
When did you “prove” that, and where was I? Other than that, I can’t admit something that is untrue.
JakeD - don’t use the generalization “they” as I’m part of that group and so are the majority of my friends, families and collegues and none of us are doing anything violent. It is a small number that has resorted to that and I’m on your side in saying that is wrong and I hope the law punishes them for that. I didn’t hear about violence at Saddleback - just loud and heated debate and protest. If there was violence or threats - that should be treated with legal action. Remember even the hundreds there don’t represent the millions that voted.
Yes Scottie, the “cowardly gays,” The ones that have been bashed daily, lynched occasionally, thrown out by their families, and experimented on by the Nazi’s are big chickens standing up for themselves, regardless of all of that!
Please don’t let me stop you from your phony defense of that poor old lady though!
Oh the humanity, they grabbed her cross!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Roseskier:
“They” specifically refers to the violent ones who WON’T let it go peacefully. Don’t get your feathers all ruffled up.
Jake D - this is a question and not a sarcastic comment in any way…so are you saying that John is wrong that a “Civil Union” isn’t equal to a “marriage” in terms of legalities - (religious equality totally aside)? Sorry if I sound dumb, but I’m just trying to understand.
“They” includes “NoDivorce” and anyone who would justify an assault and battery.
Roseskier:
I am saying that John is wrong.
jakeD - thanks for clarifying.
Just want to be sure you understand I personally don’t condone violence and if I new even one of those jerks I beat them silly. 
Just kidding, but I would turn them into the police.
Jake, gays have families. Marriage would protect their children. Civilization will not cease due to gay marriage anymore than it would from straight marriage. People can reproduce without getting married, and many do so. Also, straights can marry and not have children. Thus, moot arguements.
Or, you used a “double negative”. Let me be clear: on the federal level, “civil union” is not the same as “marriage”.
JakeD - thanks for clarifying!
Carla:
Go back to work.
Roseskier:
You’re welcome.
Ha, my boss is making a ’stop the h8ters’ t-shirt right now for the rally tomorrow. Work can wait.
Well, I learned a little something here today from JakeD so thanks for that and we’ll continue to disagree on our vote, but at least we both agree that violence isn’t the answer for anyone - ever. And, hey, we managed to have a pretty civil discussion. It is possible.
Carla:
Does the boss know you posted (just on this thread) at 1:11 pm, 1:35 pm, 1:45 pm, 1:49 pm, 1:56 pm (including an obscene sex act), 2:01 pm, 2:06 pm, 2:09 pm, 2:17 pm , 2:20 pm, 2:26 pm, 2:32 pm, 2:42 pm, 2:43 pm, 2:45 pm, 2:55 pm, 3:08 pm, 3:22 pm and 3:26 pm? Let me guess, you work for a government agency somewhere?
Roseskier:
I never said that violence isn’t the answer for anyone - ever. Legal violence is sometimes the last resort we are forced to take.
Yes it is possible, Roseskier! I do believe with all my heart that gays will get their right to marry back and soon! Gay marriage doesn’t hurt anyone, its good for families, inspirational to the youth, it boosts the economy, and the people are starting to see it.
It’s all fun and games until some people get their teeth kicked in. Who thinks it’s going to get physical this weekend? I bet I can stuff Carla’s “Stop the h8ters” t-shirt in her mouth.
I have never justified attacking anyone. That simply was not an assault.
Even if it was that one incident does not define the whole pro gay marriage campaign.
Just as Eric Robert Rudolf does not represent all anti-abortion protesters. I have never heard of any person changing their core beliefs on abortion because of more than a few zealots on the anti abortion side.
Then some of you say “its over. Stop.”
But of course not the case with abortion!! Waivers!!!!
Protecting an unborn human life is much different than a fake marriage license that Gavin Newsome handed out.
Yeah Scottie just look for the bull dyke! Can’t wait.
Jake, I work in design, I’m awaiting a sample approval. Oh yeah, and not only do I have gay co-workers whom ARE hard at work right now, but I work for one of the most successful manufacturing plants in California. Hate gays then buy chinese. Again…when am I gonna hear about how this is about love and marriage? Still sounds like sporting match to me.
Carla - Do you still have all your teeth? Are you going to prove excessive BJ’s don’t cause brain damage this weekend? You know if you do it at a gay event you’ll probably have a lot less volunteers. As I said before, I sure would like to give you a pearl necklace. And don’t worry, it’s not Gay or Chinese!
Carla:
Just as soon as you answer my questions I already asked you.
Man I envy your wife Scottie. She’s got a real winner. Some one who knows about true sanctity of marriage.
Speaking of, did you guys know Massachusetts has the lowest divorce rate in the country, despite gay marriage being legal? Seems like gay marriage HELPS hetro marriage to me.
What questions Jake?
“Protecting an unborn human life is much different than a fake marriage license that Gavin Newsome handed out.”
Where did you read that in the Constitution? Do you have “special rights?” Did I miss the part that gives anti abortion protesters the right to assassinate, bomb, and harass in order to get their way?
Then you freak out over someone grabbing something out of someone’s hands as an act of terrorism!!
LMAO!!!!
Carla - was that a yes you have all your teeth or no your missing the ones in the middle from all that frontal friction? Either way, why don’t you move to Massachusetts and take your co-workers with you. Maybe then you can all get married and you still have a variety of fellatio contestants.
The Evangelical South is the leader in divorces!
Imagine that! The “Protectors Of The Bible.” Defying Gods order with over a 50% divorce rate.
Its an ABOMINATION. Its in the BIBLE!
WAIVERS
Wow Carla - I thought you’d respond by now as you commonly do. You must be busy on your knees…
Actually Scottie, my sample came back, so now I really do have to go back to work. Thanks for proving what I already knew about you h8ters.
Jake, thanks for saving civilization and all. Kudos.
So in the “Secret Protesters Guide,” will you be allowed to defend the Bible against divorce with assassination, bombs and assault too?
Or does divorce get a WAIVER?
Why are people saying that it is ok for the “No on 8″ or gay lobby to hate church and other people/groups?I guess the argument is that hating is “ok” only if you are of the “right type of person.”
Also, I hope people remember the long and loud message that there was going to be no downside to those of a contrary opinion. Clearly they lied.
So, lying, hating. What a great way to win an argument, or take a position. next they’ll be saying that it was forced upon them, that they had to lie and hate etc.
Who knows, maybe they also want people to be arrested for hating their lifestyle, while they might such as medals, glory, and even money for their position and their projection of hate. Freedom of speech etc clearly is only meant for them.
Drew
No on 8 supporters are not hating anyone. They are just BOYCOTTING business that do not share their opinion. Which is guaranteed in the 1st amendment.
Also, If you have a problem with BOYCOTTING business that do not share their opinion then you probably have a are opposed to the Montgomery bus boycott as well.
Churches use boycotts all the time Drew. Ford, Target, Disney, McDonalds, just to name a few. They protest too!
Now maybe your “Secret Protesters Guide” says you can’t have your own tactics used against you, I don’t know.
Anyone laying down on the courthouse steps to protest divorce tomorrow? Is that in your guide or has divorce been given a WAIVER?
Carla:
You’re welcome.
NoDivorce:
Don’t you think there’s a little difference between boycotting multi-billion dollar corporations and targeting someone for a $25 political contribution?
“Don’t you think there’s a little difference between boycotting multi-billion dollar corporations and targeting someone for a $25 political contribution?”
No.
But there you go again. Does it say that in your “Secret Protesters Guide?” Where do you come up with these things?
I understand some McDonald’s in the South had to lay off some employees because of a Christian boycott. I’m sure there are many other instances of that happening. They are just different tactics.
Its just COMMON SENSE.
California kindergarten curriculum on homosexuality without notice or opt-out.
http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,445865,00.html
California kindergarten curriculum on homosexuality.
http://www.abclocal.go.com/kgo/story?section=news/local/east_bay&id=6467358
Massachusetts preschool and kindergarten curriculum.
http://www.boston.com/news/local/massachusetts/articles/2006/05/05/gay_marriage_opponents_say_ruling_stifles_their_rights_in_schools/
Massachusetts kindergarten curriculum without parent notice or opt-out.
http://www.nytimes.com/2007/02/24/education/24brfs-gay.html?ex=1329973200&en=7b09cc6bd0e9cd52&ei=5088&partner=rssnyt&emc=rss
After reading the majority of comments so far, I think it would be wise for everyone to educate themselves on what is actually going on, what the fight is about, and what their fundamental rights actually are. let’s start with rights:
http://www.un.org/Overview/rights.html
The Declaration of Human Rights, article 16 states: (1) Men and women of full age, without any limitation due to race, nationality or religion, have the right to marry and to found a family. They are entitled to equal rights as to marriage, during marriage and at its dissolution.
No where does it state that marriage is defined as heterosexual, but it IS a human right.
From the US constitution, amendment 14(legal interpretation): For instance, the right to marry is a fundamental
right protected by the due process clause, 646 and only ‘‘reasonable
regulations’’ of such relationship may be imposed. 647
The court case going before the judge right now challenges the constitutional validity of the measure due to the fact that homosexuals are considered a “suspect class” in the state of California, some rights, it seems, cannot be amended or revised by simply majority vote, as outlined by the CA constitution. Prior to the amendment to the CA constitution in 1977, the CA constitution had no legal language defining marriage as being between a man and a woman. Neither do most states, and the federal government, and the Declaration of Human Rights. The CA courts simply overturned a previous revision to the constitution, and restored it back to it’s original state, which allowed gay marriages to go forward.
Not one civil rights case has been won by popular vote in this country. Not one. Our civil rights should not be decided by popular votes, they should be inherently guaranteed by the constitution, to protect the minority from the tyranny of the majority.
So marriage has been defined as between a man and a woman for 5,000 years by Judaism, Islam Buddhism and Christianity. Read the bible. There are plenty of references that the earth should have already spontaneously combusted. There are also references that women shouldn’t have rights. Do we need to go back to the times when slavery was acceptable? Well heck- it got the pyramids built! I don’t think so. Should we all have the American Idol contestants stoned to death because they are idols of millions of fans, and teenage girls should be tried and crucified for having posters of them on their bedroom walls? It is astounding to me that our country has a statue that reads “Give me your tired, your poor, Your huddled masses yearning to breathe free,” yet we continue to discriminate people based on the color of their skin or their sexual orientation. It’s time for change and Obama is exactly it. If India can have a female prime minister (Indira Gandhi -Jan. 24, 1966 to March 24, 1977,Jan. 14, 1980 to Oct. 31,1984) hmmmmm, let me think about that for a second. WTF U.S.A. ?
Honestly people. Why does it matter to you if two men or two women get married? BIG DEAL!!!! So they want to live happily ever after with each other. Doesn’t everyone want to with the person they love? If your kids turned out to be gay. Wouldn’t you want them to live a long and happy life away from hate and violence? Granted, Im sure that half of you here would Kick your child out of the house, Disown them, want nothing to do with them. I sure some of you could never believe that YOUR child could be gay. Well, guess what, if they were, they wouldn’t tell you. They would be scared for their lives. They would wonder what would happen if they did and where to go if YOU found out. After half the stuff i read on here, I don’t blame them.
Its amazing how Yes on 8 says it protects families. But the true question is from what? Are gay people pounding on your door telling you to come with them? Gay people trying to convert you? What is it that your family needs protection from? The fact of the matter is that gay people are normal people too. If you want to protect families, you should BAN DIVORCE. If there’s anything here that will keep a family together is to BAN that from happening. Make them go to marriage counseling. MAKE them work it out. Isn’t that the goal of this? KEEP FAMILIES TOGETHER!!!! Sad thing is, if that was on the ballot, Im sure it wouldn’t pass. It won’t pass cause those that vote against it, probably hate their husband or wife. Or they don’t wanna let on that there’s ANOTHER person on the side. Who wants to be stuck with someone they don’t love right? You realize that your “I DO” is more of an “I DON’T”. Look, I think that if people don’t want gay people to marry, they shouldn’t let those that CAN come in and out of them so easily either.
Now about God. You can throw God into this all you want. God said this, and God said that. The truth of the matter is that we have MANY MANY religions out there and according to them they are all right. Who determines which one is right? GOD DOES. What it comes down to is how you love one other. WE ARE ALL GODS CHILDREN!!! WE WERE CREATED IN HIS IMAGE!!!! He knew who was gonna be straight, he knew who was gonna be gay. He created everyone the way he wanted to. YOUR test to love your fellow man is here. Whether you fail this test or not is up to you. DO UNTO OTHERS, AS YOU WOULD HAVE THEM DO UNTO YOU!!!! Hate all you want. Its you in the end that will have to answer why to him.
The political pendulum swings the way it does from one extreme to the other because compromise is too rare a quality people practice. In the early 80’s gay activists worked hard to secure basic human rights for homosexual couples, which has been secured by California Family Code 297.5, granting to same-sex couples the same basic human and civil rights that married couples enjoy. Rational minds would recognize a hard won victory and know the importance of compromise, but hate filled minds are not rational and will not listen to reason. It’s no longer about gay couples’ rights, but about venting anger after the democratic process has not worked in their favor.
For the last time, I don’t “hate” homosexuals.
The same example? Really? Out of all the thousands of protests that went on over the weekend the only example of “hate” is the same example from Friday? Hmm, not very convincing. If you love old ladies so much, I assume you support these: http://www.indybay.org/newsitems/2008/11/10/18550184.php
Unfortunately, the southern California fire coverage blanketed out any “protest” violent or not. As for “hate” from old ladies, young homosexals, EITHER SIDE, I cannot support it.
Just let the old ladies who get love each other get married then! Jeez, they can’t reproduce anymore anyway, so whats the big deal? Or should we ban all elderly from marriage, as it doesn’t help “civilization” anyhow? Can we expect that on the ballot?
No, because it’s not the proper example for the rest of society. IT’S FOR THE CHILDREN!
We don’t let a brother marry his sister after menopause either.
My grandpa getting married three times to three different women is a proper example? I don’t think thats why he did it, I think he just doesnt like to cook for himself.
And do you know of any brothers who want to marry sisters? I don’t. The point is moot.
Just search Google (I’m boycotting them) for news stories on all the brothers who wants to marry their sister. It’s being called “Genetic Sexual Attraction” (GSA) now, and I’m sure the APA will say it’s just fine soon enough.
In February 2007, there was a report that a brother and sister couple in Germany were fighting against anti-incest laws. They grew up separately, met as adults, and have had four children.
Again, I don’t know any. When and if I do I’ll listen to their side.
I don’t have to Google “gays”. My out friends and family have proven to me that they make positive partners and parents. They inspire me. I love them with all my heart and they love me back, and never ever have voiced anti-straight feelings to me. They don’t want to take away my rights and they don’t want to destroy civilization. How can I look them in the eye and say that I am superior to them? On what grounds? That I was born attracted to men? So so silly.
Do you know any prostitutes? If not, then I guess it’s OK to legalize that too. For the record, I am not saying that I am “superior” to homosexuals or anyone else for that matter. So, I’m not sure why you think I can answer how you should act.
I do know a call girl, yes, and she has been married. Its legal for prostitutes to get married. If you are asking if prostitution should be legal, I do agree it should be decriminalized and sanctioned, for the health and protection of my friend. Do I agree with married men sleeping with women other than their wives? No, I think thats bad, but legal issues havent stopped many.
You do believe you are superior to homosexuals. You believe you can get married but they can’t. Simple.
Well, for 35 years, I was licensed to practice law in the State of California too. That didn’t make me “superior” to any non-lawyer. Next canard?
Again, I “believe” that I can get married but a brother and sister can’t. There’s no issue of “superiority” there either.
Carla:
You seem to be goinf far afield, though, from the thread topic: “Prop. 8 backers complain of ongoing harrassment”. Is there anything you want to add to that?
goinf = going
Its not a “right” to practice law, that’s a career position that must be earned academically. But gee, I agree with you,..as a non-lawyer I sure am not inferior to you when it comes to a discussion!
So, we agree on something at least : )
Thanks Jake! I really don’t see how I can make my position any more clear, so I suppose I should get back to work now and just hope for the best come next election.
Personally, I don’t think it’s anyone’s business if two men or two women decide to get married. You’re not God so don’t judge. In my vast christian experience however, it’s hard for a majority of them to do that. They’re so stuck on what’s right and wrong that they don’t even realize it’s none of their business.
I also read a post earlier that said a little girl going through puberty would feel uncomfortable talking to her two dads about it. How does that make sense? If a Man loses his Wife should we take his daughter away because he’s not the right sex? No, I’m fairly certain we would trust him to explain this stuff to her. Same for gay people, just because they’re gay doesn’t mean they don’t know how things work. It’s called biology, they taught it in High School, for those of you that got past that.
Trey:
I made it through law school, thank you very much. Do you think it’s “our business” if one man and two or three women decide to get married? That’s called POLYGAMY and currently outlawed too. Where (if at all) will you draw the line?
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/California_Proposition_8_(2008)#Proponents
Check out this website. Particularly unbiased on the history.
It should be known that the Proponents of Prop 8 initiated the process to change the constitution.
Before I get blasted, I will disclose that I am half of one of “those” couples that exchanged vows while “it” was still legal.
For me, the “fight” is not about what to settle for. I didn’t feel any less committed to my spouse after the vows, just more offical and permanent with half the paperwork. The fight is all about EQUALITY in the eyes of the state.
The central theme in the “fight” appears to be the religious intolerance by the “organized” proponents of Prop 8, namely those mentioned in the Wikipedia link. This is very much a “sacred” cow as is abortion and the (non)-rights of women in their churches.
I am not calling anyone haters, racist, or biased, that said there is a precedent that has been set by these churches. Namely to inject their religious interpretation to the “secular” right of marriage. And to define it for all races and religions of people in CA. Surely this is the downside of easily financed ballot props and simple majority vote that is the rule in CA.
We shall see what merit there is to the judicial process at this point.
I do not condone harassment or stupidity. Some of the things I saw leading up to the elections were really bad (on both sides). As with any struggle for rights and recognition, it is anyone’s right to peacefully assemble and protest. Boycott too, if you think it will make a difference. Tactics that are analogous to yelling “fire” in a crowded theatre are unwelcome. The conservative religions use this as a staple to keep the masses in-line.
What is hard to stomach is trying to judge the issue by relaying anecdotal evidence that is fringe at best. Both sides do this, and its far too much talking and not enough listening and understanding. There needs to be dialog, but I can tell you the GLBT folk have been battling for dialog for years with these groups and there is no budge.
The moral dilemma is the fact that MONEY (the root of all evil) is usually the impetus that drives these Ballot measures, unless it is just a complete shoo-in. Certainly the religious right has the money and will outspend (even if it does come from other States). All the more fodder for opponents of Prop 8 to feel disenfranchised. I don’t blame anyone that is opposed to Prop 8 for feeling the way they do.
These same churches have persecuted, called out, and excommunicated many GLBT persons or even those suspected of the “Gay influence” from their ranks. If you can’t seek reparitive therapy or be celibate (even if you are in a committed relationship), then you are done. No place for you at that table.
Loving someone of the same sex, in all forms of love, is not criminal. Unfortunately, it is against some form of creed, moral code, or interpretation of the bible for these religions. For those non-religious, its against something “natural”. Again, its not about what works for you but what will work for another couple and what rights are afforded to that other couple.
Are the people of CA who voted for this Prop. that needy to think their families would be negatively affected by others seeking permanency somewhat equalling their own? I can’t help to think that many of them do not know any gay couples at all.
Is it a stretch to say that anyone who wants to really keep “secular” marriage valid and traditional would want to REALLY commit to ONE other person for life…or at least till death do you part? (whether its two men, two women, or a man and a woman)
When I took my vows, it was to one person. Not my dog, not my Mom, not an inanimate object. It was a committment no matter what the circumstance (no mere mention of kids in the picture). I could be happy with a civil union and a mound of legal paperwork, but is it equal? If it is, then you’ll have to convince me how my marriage is different from a man-woman marriage where no kids are involved. If its not, then why not?
I sure hope that many more of the “faceless, nameless” gay couples come out and make themselves be known to others, especially to children to demystify and de-demonize. It seems to me some of the most vocal opponents to prop 8 were and are the younger generation, taking up the cause for those that came before them. Sounds pretty familiar with many civil rights causes.
It is unfortunate that this vote could’ve been THE olive branch to the conservatives in this state and it was basically turned down and run over with a HumVee. Still US and THEM and never the twain should meet. That’s too bad for everyone.
The struggle for gay rights will continue. The symbol of the rainbow is still appropriate. We come from all colors (and all religions, whether they wanted us or not). We deserve the same place setting at the table of life, although we’ve learned to get by on what is afforded. We shall never hang our heads in shame for what others think, do, or say about us. No one is perfect. In the voice of Christianity, we are all sinners in God’s eyes.
Love your neighbor as yourself.
We are all God’s children.
JakeD:
I think that’s also really none of your business. Honestly if more than two individuals wanted to enter a relationship together, more power to them. That’s their choice and none of my concern. As long as they aren’t hurting anyone then I don’t see the problem.
So how is it helpful pointing out that you’re a lawyer and then pointing at something that also, isn’t your business? Besides the issue isn’t polygamy it’s homosexuality. Where only two individuals are wanting the same rights accorded to heterosexual people. When are people going to learn that homosexuality HAS been around since the dawn of time? Read a little history instead of those law books. Those who don’t learn from history are doomed to repeat it. So I guess in the end we’ll win since black people and women made it. Well that makes me feel better, cause I personally hate discrimination.
The reason I brought up Law School was to point out that some of us Prop. 8 supporters did, in fact, pass “biology taught n High School”. You will note that I don’t resort to personal attacks against anyone’s level of education. That being said, the point is we DO discriminate (polygamy being just one example), If that’s none of â??our businessâ?? how about NAMBLA? They say they aren’t hurting anyone either. I am still wondering:
Where (if at all) will you draw the line?
I guess the line will be drawn no where. A very short and incomplete list of recent strikes against churches:
Salt Lake City:
At least 8 Mormon Churches Vandalized
Layton/Ogden:
7 Mormon Churches had windows shot out with a BB Gun
San Diego:
Mormon Church Vandalized to shouts of, â??Mormon Scum!â??
Sacramento:
10 Mormon Churches have been vandalized
Colorado:
A Mormon Bible was burned and left on the steps of a church
Olympia:
Clandestine Bash Back! operatives glue locks and spray paint Mormon Church
Michigan:
Bash Back! disrupts Mt. Hope Church service
There were some very interesting comments, and some rather stupid ones too.
There were some 18,000 same sex marriages. They claim that Prop. 8 didn’t take away anyone’s rights. Didn’t they?
Is it a sin to be gay? Sin involves choice. I don’t remember ever deciding that I wanted to be gay.
Protecting children? Every year 3,000 some teenagers commit suicide. It is estimated that less than 1/3 of the suicides are reported, and many of those have sexual identity issues. Who protecting the gay kids?
Civil union vs. marriage. Sound vaguely of separate but equal. Has anyone ever heard of Brown vs the Board of Eduction? Separate is inherently unequal.
Gay people usually come from straight homes. And straight kids come from gay homes.
In legal terms, marriage is simply a contract. If procreation was the issue, then no women over 50 should be allowed to marry.
Have you ever heard of a group of gay men beating up a guy because he was straight? Have you every heard of a gay man killing a straight man because he was straight?
God keep trying to send a message to the straights who support hate legislation like Prop 8. It is no accident that hurricanes, wildfires, economic hardships, and other anathemas are visited on the Bible belt. God wants these people to wake up to the hatred they profess in his name. Like the ancient Egyptians, the American “xtians” don’t listen. They perpetrate hate in his name, and so, the plagues continue…
first of we all know Bin Laden is dead and with no solid piece of eviedence that he was part of 9/11. and also amsterdam does gay mariiage and other countries and they also smoke pot. look what do you ppl want to be like the 3rd world where we can have keep our son but throw our daughters into the street and become prostitutes. thats what alot of countries end up becoming when you dont know you limits watch as slowly amsterdam goes down the drain. And us soon, do i have to mention Las Vegas thats a hell hole. Whats the point of putting someones religious beliefs that are protected by the 1st amendment and voting if they should be protect by the amendment or have them forced to allow gay marriage, you say the pastors and priests and all have a choice but that was the BIGGEST lie of all churches were being sued also hospitals, and used hate crime to sue. thats like taking a dump on the constitution. REALLY STOP COMPLAINING ABOUT THE OUTCOME U SHOULD BE EVEN GLAD YOU WERE VOTING ON A PERSON’S BELIEFS. NOT JUST CHRISTIANS, BUT ALSO JEWS AND MUSLIMS. VOTING IS DEMOCRATIC AND TO SAY THAT A FEW DIDNT LIKE THE OUTCOME THEY WANT ONLY WHAT THEY WANT NOT CARING ABOUT THE MAJORITY.
They claim that Prop. 8 didn’t take away anyone’s rights. Didn’t they? “Yes, no rights were taken they have rights the same the marriage gets, but marriage isn’t are right which some ppl actually believe that which is also false government decided to give marriage rights cuz of kids and other things. gays cant give natural birth to kids so they dont need the one hospital right to help with the payment.”
Is it a sin to be gay? “No, its just sins takin in. girls out number guys 3 to 1 so 1guy one girl leaves 2 with no other option but to either be alone or turn friendship with another woman into a type of sexual relationship that a man and woman would normally have. Guys become gay cuz their sexual hormons kicking in when they dont have any woman to have sex with they turn to a man. thats why there are more gay women then men.”
Protecting children? “Yes cuz they have to teach everything that they think is required, my opinion that marriage shouldnt even be taught at all cuz ppl get this desepition that marriage is miserable but you have to get married or you’ll be misrable even more. marriage was made by christians joining man and woman and god, thats how marraige was made and is a really a religious thing why they get married not just love. so dont say ’shouldnt you marry the person you love’, the word love is so misunderstood, love means you really care about something it doesnt mean its just only about sexual and relationship things, i love my friends and family should i marry them?” Every year 3,000 some teenagers commit suicide. “Sad ppl do this cuz it kills the person physically but it menatly kills everyone that was close to them. only if they knew how much ppl really cared about them” It is estimated that less than 1/3 of the suicides are reported, and many of those have sexual identity issues. Who protecting the gay kids? “why seperate only 1/3 what about the other 2/3 shouldnt it be more like ‘whose protecting them?’, your saying that gay ones are more important, i have seen things in my life and i know one thing when someone says equality it is almost always being used in the wrong waythey need help just like everyone other teen that thinks about commiting suicide, therapists and help lines.”
Civil union vs. marriage. Sound vaguely of separate but equal. Has anyone ever heard of Brown vs the Board of Eduction? “that was diffeferent its in the constitution that all need education and not allowing blacks in was being unjustful. This is different this goes against the first amendment, it says gays cant sue churches but they lied like what i said before they sued the hate crime thing to force christians to marry them or face law suits or lose tax exempts if they didnt do what the gays asked for.”
Gay people usually come from straight homes. And straight kids come from gay homes. “by far not true where in the world did you get that info i have never heard something so false ever. My mom and Dad are straight and im straight, everyone i know came from a straight family and they arent gay either. and actually if the child is the same-sex as the gay couple, like daughter with 2 mothers they end up growing up like that cuz they are raised around woman so if it was a son he would grow up straight cuz he was raised to woman but he would be an emotional guy, but he would be straight so your answer is way off, i only know one girl who is bisexual but leaning towards being a lesbian cuz she only has a dad and since the dad is straight and raised to like women she likes women, but it is a choice when you have a mom and dad, but most you go with the opposite sex almost like closely around 97% of the time.”
In legal terms, marriage is simply a contract. “absolutly false, i take back what i just said before this is the most false thing i have ever heard, if mariarage was just simply a contract then im married to my job cuz i have a contract to with it. no, marriage is religious and not just love, christians got married before they had papers back then they married cuz of religious beliefs and love, the love of their opposite sex but religious reasons too. you guys and girls that are gay can make your own one that you want and present it to the nation and you dont have to take from another person’s religious name for they’re bond. (just sudjesting) Maybe like Civil Rlation Bond, dosent sound that great but you ppl really want something you can make your own that you want with your rights that you want you dont have to pladgerize someone elses religion.”
Have you ever heard of a group of gay men beating up a guy because he was straight? “Yes in fact i have in West Hollywood” Have you every heard of a gay man killing a straight man because he was straight? “Yes also in San Fransisco”
PROP 8 PASS SO JUST STOP STANDING IN THE STREETS YOU LOOK LIKE IDIOTS, “VOTE NO ON 8″ WHEN ITS OVER. HEY ITS DEMOCRACY NO MATTER WHAT YOU THINK IT SHOULD BE, HITLER THOUGHT THE SAME AND LOOK HOW THAT TURNED OUT, MAJORITY ROLLS 52 AND THEY DIDNT EVEN HAVE TNE VOTES FROM THE MEN AND WOMEN FIGHTING IN IRAG AND AFGANISTAN THAT LIVE IN CALIFORNIA. HEY IF THERE IS 100 PEOPLE AND ONLY ONE PERSON WANTS TOFLY KITES AND THE OTHER 99 WANT TO PLAY TAG SHOULD THE 1 PERSON BE OVER THE 99 THAT ISNT DEMOCRACY. YOU PPL ARE LIKE IF ITS NOT WHAT I WANT THEN I HAVE TO BE A CRYING BABY ABOUT IT. I DIDNT WANT OBAMA TO WIN BUT DO YOU SEE ME YELLING ITS NOT FAIR CUZ THE MAJORITY VOTED FOR HIM BUT I DIDNT WHAT COUNTRY WOULD WE BE IF WE ONLY LISTEN TO THE SMALLER GROUP. PROBABLY ANARCHY. AND NOW YOU ARE LIKE OH NOW WE HAVE TO GO TO THE SUPREME COURT CUZ WE CANT LISTEN TO MAJORITY. THATS LIKE SAYING SHOULD THERE BE SMOKING IN RESTURANTS AND YOU ONLY LET THE SMOKERS VOTE. YOU SAY EQUALITY BUT YOU JUST WANT WHATS GOOD FOR YOU PPL NOT THE MAJORITY, SO MOVE TO ANOTHER COUNTRY IF YOU DONT LIKE IT THEN GEZ. YOU SAY THESE OTHER COUNTRIES ALLOW GAY MARRIAGE, IF ITS SO GREAT WHY DONT YOU JUST MOVE THERE. AMERICA WAS MEANT TO BE DIFFENT FROM WHAT OTHER COUNTRIES WOULD ALLOW. FREEDOM FOR BEING RULED BY FEAR OF MILITANTS. IF YOU WANT GAY MARRIAGE THEN MOVE TO ANOTHER COUNTRY NO ONE IS GOING TO STOP YOU. OTHER STATES VOTED ON IT TOO YOU KNOW AND THE ALSO SAID NO LIKE ARIZONA AND NEVADA I THINK THOSE ARE THE OTHER ONES. WERE JUST THE ONLY ONE THAT HAS HAD IT SO QUICKLY CHANGED BACK. IT CANT GO BACK TO CALIFORNIA SUPREME COURT CUZ NO DOUBLE JEOPARDY, WHICH THEY DID THE FIRST TIME WHEN THEY PASSED IT, IT WILL HAVE TO GO TO THE us SUPREME COURT AND THEY WILL HAVE TO VOTE FOR THE NATION AND SO MARJORITY DONT WANT IT THEN THE OTHER 2 STATES THAT HAVE GAY MARRIAGE WILL HAVE IT REMOVED. SO BAD IDEA FOR GAY MARRIAGE SUPPORTERS IF THEY TRY THAT MOVE. SO PACK YOUR BAGS AND ALL U MOVE TO THE POT SMOKING, PROSTITUTING, STD, DRUG FILLED GAY MARRIAGE AMSTERDAM OR WHAT EVER COUNTRY. DONT WORRY IN THOSE COUNRTIES YOULL BE SURROUNDED BY SMALL PARTIES THAT ONLY WANT WHAT THE MAJORTY DOESNT WANT AND IT MOST LIKELY WONT BE WHAT YOU WANT. BUT DONT WORRY WOMEN THAT MOVE, IT GETS WORSE, THEY WILL HAVE MILITARY MEN COME IN AND HAVE THERE WAY WITH YOU AND THEN YOU GET TO HAVE FUN SHAKLED UP MAKING MONEY BY BEING MEN’S SEX SLAVES OH DONT WORRY THE COPS WILL BE THERE, THEY WILL BE IN THE SAME ROOM GETTING THEIR WAY WITH YOU TOO. ISNT IT WONDERFUL TO BE A PROSTITUTE THAT GETS CIGARETTS BURNT INTO THEIR SKIN. SO EITHER BE GLAD FOR THE OUTCOME OR MOVE TO A COUNTRY THAT HAS NEVER HEARD OF FREEDOM BUT THEY HAVE HEARD OF TRAFFIKING. GOOD LUCK ON THAT HOPE YOU MAKE THE RIGHT CHOICE IN DECIDING.
SORRY ABOUT THE SECOND THING I WROTE ON THE SECOND PARAGRAPH, MESSED UP THE FIRST SENTENCE
They claim that Prop. 8 didn’t take away anyone’s rights. Didn’t they? “Yes, no rights were taken they have rights the same the marriage gets, but marriage isn’t are right which some ppl actually believe that which is also false government decided to give marriage rights cuz of kids and other things. gays cant give natural birth to kids so they dont need the one hospital right to help with the payment.”
Is it a sin to be gay? “No, its just SEXUAL HORMONS takin in. girls out number guys 3 to 1 so 1guy one girl leaves 2 with no other option but to either be alone or turn friendship with another woman into a type of sexual relationship that a man and woman would normally have. Guys become gay cuz their sexual hormons kicking in when they dont have any woman to have sex with they turn to a man. thats why there are more gay women then men.”
Protecting children? “Yes cuz they have to teach everything that they think is required, my opinion that marriage shouldnt even be taught at all cuz ppl get this desepition that marriage is miserable but you have to get married or you’ll be misrable even more. marriage was made by christians joining man and woman and god, thats how marraige was made and is a really a religious thing why they get married not just love. so dont say ’shouldnt you marry the person you love’, the word love is so misunderstood, love means you really care about something it doesnt mean its just only about sexual and relationship things, i love my friends and family should i marry them?” Every year 3,000 some teenagers commit suicide. “Sad ppl do this cuz it kills the person physically but it menatly kills everyone that was close to them. only if they knew how much ppl really cared about them” It is estimated that less than 1/3 of the suicides are reported, and many of those have sexual identity issues. Who protecting the gay kids? “why seperate only 1/3 what about the other 2/3 shouldnt it be more like ‘whose protecting them?’, your saying that gay ones are more important, i have seen things in my life and i know one thing when someone says equality it is almost always being used in the wrong waythey need help just like everyone other teen that thinks about commiting suicide, therapists and help lines.”
Civil union vs. marriage. Sound vaguely of separate but equal. Has anyone ever heard of Brown vs the Board of Eduction? “that was diffeferent its in the constitution that all need education and not allowing blacks in was being unjustful. This is different this goes against the first amendment, it says gays cant sue churches but they lied like what i said before they sued the hate crime thing to force christians to marry them or face law suits or lose tax exempts if they didnt do what the gays asked for.”
Gay people usually come from straight homes. And straight kids come from gay homes. “by far not true where in the world did you get that info i have never heard something so false ever. My mom and Dad are straight and im straight, everyone i know came from a straight family and they arent gay either. and actually if the child is the same-sex as the gay couple, like daughter with 2 mothers they end up growing up like that cuz they are raised around woman so if it was a son he would grow up straight cuz he was raised to woman but he would be an emotional guy, but he would be straight so your answer is way off, i only know one girl who is bisexual but leaning towards being a lesbian cuz she only has a dad and since the dad is straight and raised to like women she likes women, but it is a choice when you have a mom and dad, but most you go with the opposite sex almost like closely around 97% of the time.”
In legal terms, marriage is simply a contract. “absolutly false, i take back what i just said before this is the most false thing i have ever heard, if mariarage was just simply a contract then im married to my job cuz i have a contract to with it. no, marriage is religious and not just love, christians got married before they had papers back then they married cuz of religious beliefs and love, the love of their opposite sex but religious reasons too. you guys and girls that are gay can make your own one that you want and present it to the nation and you dont have to take from another person’s religious name for they’re bond. (just sudjesting) Maybe like Civil Rlation Bond, dosent sound that great but you ppl really want something you can make your own that you want with your rights that you want you dont have to pladgerize someone elses religion.”
Have you ever heard of a group of gay men beating up a guy because he was straight? “Yes in fact i have in West Hollywood” Have you every heard of a gay man killing a straight man because he was straight? “Yes also in San Fransisco”